Columnist vs. councilman

In a Thurssday column, Asheville Citizen-Times writer John Boyle examined a charge that Asheville City Councilman Carl Mumpower, in his crusade against illegal immigration, has been employing the same scare tactics as anti-communist Joe McCarthy in the 1950s.

Mumpower had a simple response: “McCarthy was right.”

Boyle’s column starts by noting that Mumpower continues to send e-mails to federal immigration officials, singling out local businesses and saying that he’s received direct information that current and former employees are illegal immigrants using false credentials. Mumpower copies his missives to his mailing list, which includes local news outlets and includes the disclaimer that “I have no idea as to the validity of these claims.” Mumpower, an Asheville psychologist, a Republican and a two-term City Council member who recently announced his run for a third term, ran an unsuccessful campaign for congress last year.

Boyle writes that there’s a problem with the tactic: “Mumpower does not validate the claims before making flimsy, anonymous assertions public.” Boyle goes on to quote Dwight Butner, owner of Vincenzo’s Ristorante, one of the restaurants Mumpower recently mentioned in one of his e-mails.

“I think Carl has become so strident and so dedicated to his cause that he’s employing the same tactics Joe McCarthy employed during the Red Scare of the 1950s,” Butner told Boyle. “He alludes to sources and information, basically saying this stuff is happening, without any evidence, which is exactly what Joe McCarthy did in the ‘50s.”

Boyle notes the lax enforcement of federal immigration laws, but argues that Mumpower’s mailings go too far. “I don’t think that means you can e-mail out serious, unsubstantiated allegations against business owners as if it’s casual conversation,” Boyle writes.

In the column, Boyle quotes Mumpower as standing by his actions. “As you know, (Immigration and Customs Enforcement) is overwhelmed, minimally accountable, underfunded, and their ability to follow through is limited. So I want to create as much visibility as possible and get some people — and you guys in the media — stirred up,” Mumpower told Boyle.

Boyle ends by recalling the words of Joseph Welch, the man who stood up to McCarthy during a public hearing by asking, “Have you no sense of decency, sir? At long last, have you left no sense of decency?”

Mumpower answers in his follow-up e-mail: “The answer is yes – McCarthy was right.”

— Jason Sandford, multimedia editor

 

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234 thoughts on “Columnist vs. councilman

  1. Fremonts Thoughts

    Its time for a change in the law. I submit my thoughts on immigration for Carl Mumpower, John Boyle and your readers opinion:

    The cause of illegal immigration are the immigration rules in place now to enter the USA. These rules must be changed in order to help make this country safer then it is now.

    The most sensible way to do so is to allow people without a waiting period to enter the USA thru a Customs/Immigration Office by presenting a government photo ID, birth certificate and/or a passport. At this point the Immigration Officer takes their DNA, an eye scan and their fingerprints. This information would be kept on a computer system that law enforcement would have access to confirm who a person is in case of a crime. Then the Immigration Officer does a criminal record search thru every criminal record system and terrorist watch list in the world that the US can electronically access. If the person in question has a record of a felony or worst or is on a terrorist watch list they are refused entry. If the person has no criminal record and is not on a terrorist watch list the Immigration Officer then issues a combined five year numbered Immigrant/Guest Worker/Social Security photo ID card that if, tamper with in anyway marks itself void. This would allow the employer, if he wishes, to do an internet check with a combined Immigration Dept./Social Security Dept. website that would confirm the cards as authentic by showing a picture of the cards and a larger photo of the person presenting the card in order for them to work. Also, it is the governments place to enforce the law, as it is not the place of the employer as they are not Law Enforcement Officers, this plan should also solve complaints from them

    At the end of five years the immigrant should be allowed to go to an Immigration Office to apply for US citizenship by showing an Immigration Officer a first grade level of reading, speaking and writing the English language and not having a felony criminal record. NO questions half the US citizens couldn’t answer themselves.

    All persons found not to have gone thru the process of legal entry after a 2-year period from the date the program is started are to be deported as soon as possible.

    We should also allow the illegal immigrants already in the country now to also go to the nearest Immigration Office and do the same as the ones above. The reason for this is there is no way this country can find all the illegal immigrants already here and return them to their native country. It would also cut the cost of finding them. And we would have a better idea of how many are here and they would then start paying taxes.

    Then Congress and the States need to approve a new amendment to the Constitution to make English the national language. This makes sense, as one of the quickest ways for someone to assimilate into a society is to learn the language of that society. The local school boards must also realize that the only way assimilate a child into the schools and the USA is to teach them in English, not in their native language. This will cut the cost of educating the Immigrant by not having to employ interpreters in the classroom and the child would also have fewer problems with the other children in school.

    This system would solve the biggest problem most people have with illegal immigrants using the services of this country without paying taxes.

    We must understand that there is NO WAY to completely secure our borders. How are we going stop them coming as a tourist? How are we going to secure entry by water? How are you going to stop people willing to pay to ride in a shipping container for two months or so to come here? How’s the drug war going? By making it easy, hopefully they should have no reason to come illegally.

    We also must remember that with more people of many different and needed skills entering the country the economy should and will improve. As these people will have many needs such as housing, jobs, cars, food, insurance, clothes etc. Many will start new businesses and create many new jobs. They will also create a new energy that this country needs to stay at number one.

  2. Chad Nesbitt

    I would like to publicly thank John Boyle and Dwight Butner for their comments and opinions.
    Boyles entire article made me take a good long look at the illegal immigration problem in the United States.
    I found a lot of information here http://www.usillegalaliens.com/

    Being born in 1970, I had heard of “McCarthyism” but really did not know who McCarthy was until after reading the comments of Butner.
    I found a good video here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmrDz5k8pEk

    After my research I have concluded the following –
    1. Illegal immigration is a major threat to the future and the safety of the United States of America.
    I will immediately follow in the footsteps of Dr. Carl Mumpower.
    Report any illegal’s working at any business.

    2. McCarthy was 100% correct. Pointing out communists is not a witch hunt. It is saving the values and principles of our nation. The pursuit of happiness. The security and future of our children.

    The communist I’m pointing out is Obama.

  3. listen to you, why?

    Chad, the apostrophe indicates possessive, not plural. So when you say you will report any illegal’s, it begs the question, report any illegal’s what? Any illegal’s children, mother, father? The illegal’s hard work?

    And you were born in 1970 so you didn’t know who McCarthy was? This is what passes for commentary in Asheville. Please tell us all about Mumpower as compared or contrasted to McCarthy, since you didn’t know who McCarthy was until a few minutes ago. Yeah, we’ll be sure to pay attention.

    The saddest part of this is not the substance that spews from Mumpower, Nesbitt, and their kind, it is the irrational and generally weak level of political argument that receives attention and passes for commentary in Asheville.

  4. shadmarsh

    Being born in 1970, I had heard of “McCarthyism” but really did not know who McCarthy was until after reading the comments of Butner.

    I was born in 1974 and I have known about McCarthy at least since I was 8. Makes me wonder where your head is….oh, wait I have a few ideas.

  5. LOKEL

    And exactly how, Chad (and anyone else, out there), are you going to know who is illegal and who is not?

  6. Bill Barnwell

    Thanks Chad: “McCarthy was 100% correct. Pointing out communists is not a witch hunt. It is saving the values and principles of our nation. The pursuit of happiness. The security and future of our children.”

    But we must excuse Boyle. He is a transplanted yankee boy who was no doubt brainwashed in journalism school. Up north, they are proud of their “progressive” roots. They sure do stick out here in the South don’t they? Well, hardly anyone buys and reads the Citizen Times anyway.

    God bless you Dr Mumpower. Keep up the good fight for the people of Asheville, and the nation as a whole. Most of us appreciate it.

  7. hauntedheadnc

    I love Mumpower. The only thing that could possibly make his act any more entertaining would be the addition of a wisecracking puppet sidekick and a selection of amusing hats.

  8. “Is Mumpower a modern-day Joe McCarthy?”

    I certainly hope so. McCarthy was right.

    McCarthy, exonerated by the Venona Papers if not before, was basically right about Soviet agents working for the U.S. government.

  9. No, seriously. Your elephant is crosseyed. You should have your designer fix it. Hell, I’d do it myself, if you weren’t such a blowhard.

  10. John

    Using a McCarthy reference in today’s society is a cheap shot and unprofessional. It is not the same as what Carl is doing at all. Carl has strange tactics no doubt, but illegal immigration and communist spies are not the same.

  11. gourmanga

    On the position of immigration you have to look at the work they do. I have worked in construction for 15 years and the reason they get the jobs is that they work hard in poor conditions. You find someone to dig a ditch for 8$ an hour for 60 hours a week.

    The biggest point this brings up for me is VOTE MUMPOWER OUT OF OFFICE. He has one foot out of the door already with his unsuccesful bid for state office. Lets clean house in our city government.

  12. John

    This all boils down to a lack of any kind of immigration policy. Whether you favor complete, immediate amnesty or shipping all illegals out of the US, we currently have no policy at all – thanks to spineless and corrupt politicians and exploitative businessmen and women.

    No other country in the world has an open border that allows undocumented and unlimited crossing.

  13. entopticon

    It fills me with glee to watch the extreme fringes of the far right wing going off the rails on the crazy train.

    I really do hope that the far right extremists never figure out that if they keep on making completely asinine, embarrassingly ignorant statements like “Obama is a communist,” they are never going to be taken the remotest bit seriously. The people saying this sort of nonsense clearly don’t even have the slightest idea of what communism is. For them it is just some buzz-word that their mouth-breathing friends toss around to refer to anyone who doesn’t support the insanity of laissez faire economics.

    It is absolutely side-splitting to see right-wing extremists saying things as completely insane as “McCarthy was 100% correct.” McCarthy was a complete lunatic and McCarthyism is rightly considered to be one of the darkest chapters in American history.

    Please, please, please…. I beg of you all…. keep up with that sort of extremist crazy talk, which will guarantee that the right-wing will never, ever be taken seriously again. Please, by all means, keep embracing McCarthyism. And whatever you do, don’t forget to make yourselves truckloads of tinfoil helmets to protect you from Obama’s communistic brainwashing rays.

    So repeat after me… “Are you now or have you ever been a member of the Communist Party?”

  14. entopticon

    John, considering that Mumpower stated that McCarthy was right, your argument that it is not fair to compare Mumpower to McCarthy makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. If you don’t like the comparison, you should take it up with Mumpower, who is clearly just fine with it.

    Yes it is true that any sane person should consider a comparison to McCarthy to be a very disturbing insult, but we clearly aren’t talking about entirely sane people here. Carl may be an endearing guy at times, but his embracing of McCarthyism is sobering reminder that many of his ideas are more than a bit nuts and his raging xenophobia isn’t just a cute amusement, it is seriously dangerous.

  15. John

    E – My point is that McCarthism was an investigation that tried to prove illegalities may have occurred. Regardless of your view on how to solve the immigration problem, hiring illegal aliens is currently illegal. That is a fact. The reporter is taking advantage of Carl’s statement to make an inaccurate comparison of the facts involving the two scenarios. Comparing what happened in those two cases is apples and oranges.

    Before you start making assumptions, I think the McCarthy trials were political show boating and that Obama is not a communist.

  16. John

    Another point. The term McCarthyism is now used to imply guilt on someone who is innocent. Framing them. That is a nasty scare tactic.

    Hiring illegal aliens is illegal. Like it or not. Scaring someone who is doing something illegal is not the same as framing someone who is innocent.

  17. entopticon

    John, the comparison was made because the baseless finger-pointing without any actual evidence that McCarthy was infamous for reflects the baseless accusations without any evidence that Mumpower currently employs. I think the comparison is entirely apt. Heck, if it’s good enough for Mumpower himself I don’t see why it’s not good enough for you. It’s hard to think of how it could be any more cut and dry.

    Again, the term McCarthyism refers to a right-wing extremist tactic of exploiting paranoid xenophobia with baseless, finger-pointing witch hunts. Considering Mumpower’s baseless accusations, calling the law on every establishment that he is suspicious of, and his xenophobic obsession with illegal aliens, it’s hard to even imagine a more appropriate term.

  18. entopticon writes: “statements like ‘Obama is a communist,’ they are never going to be taken the remotest bit seriously.”

    Actually, Obama’s own political philosophy comes closer to Marxism than Communism. So far, his public policy is fascistic.

    entopticon writes: “For them it is just some buzz-word that their mouth-breathing friends toss around to refer to anyone who doesn’t support the insanity of laissez faire economics.”

    There is no laissez-faire economics; never has been. (Name an unregulated market.) What we have is an interventionist government (aka mixed economy). Our present economic crisis is due to the failure of interventionist, regulatory interference in the economy by government. ‘Twas ever thus.

    http://snipr.com/hmpro

  19. “Again, the term McCarthyism refers to a right-wing extremist tactic of exploiting paranoid xenophobia with baseless, finger-pointing witch hunts.”

    But McCarthy was vindicated by the evidence of the Venona Project. He was right.

  20. shadmarsh

    Tim, he was not.

    Mcarthy engaged in red baiting, ruining the lives of thousands Americans directly and indirectly. Why? because they may or may not have had a political stance that was outside of the mainstream.
    McCarthy used his so-called lists, which were completely unrelated to the Venona Project, and most likely fabricated, to further his own political agenda through fear and bullying.

    How do you square the stance, of the government, or members thereof abusing their political office by compiling secret lists of people who have not been accused of any crime, with your so-called Libertarian “philosophy”?

  21. entopticon

    Thank you Tim. Keep up the fine work. Obama is definitely a Marxist and probably a black Muslim space alien too, so don’t forget the tinfoil helmets.

    And by all means, I will do everything I can to assist you in getting the message out that right-wing extremists believe that McCarthyism is good and that McCarthyism was actually vindicated by the Venona Project.

    Don’t worry, as the parties of McCarthyism, there is no possible way that libertarians and far right Republicans could possibly lose. If you really want to guarantee your success you could also become the pro-swine-flu party, although that won’t help you quite as much as embracing McCarthyism.

  22. travelah

    McCarthyism style tactics know no political boundaries. McCarthy was an abusive politician who used a legitimate issue to fuel his own time in the spotlight. The key to understanding that time period (as brief as it was)is recognizing that the issues driving the public spectacle were very valid and of concern. The manner and abusiveness of the proceedings overshadowed the seriousness of the matter for a generation or two.
    Hopefully this county will find themselves with another Mr. Welch when cooler minds prevail over the rabble now running the government. (As an aside, Obama is not a Communist. I refer to him as an Obamunist only as a play on his name and his decidely far leftist inclinations. He is indeed obaminable.)

  23. Piffy!

    *””How do you square the stance, of the government, or members thereof abusing their political office by compiling secret lists of people who have not been accused of any crime, with your so-called Libertarian “philosophy”? “”**

    He can’t.

  24. Ken Hanke

    The conservatives around here are probably the best friends the Democratic party ever had.

  25. Chad Nesbitt

    Listen to you, why said – “The saddest part of this is not the substance that spews from Mumpower, Nesbitt, and their kind, it is the irrational and generally weak level of political argument that receives attention and passes for commentary in Asheville.“

    My reply – Heard your radio show.
    “Stay tuned!”

  26. Chad Nesbitt

    Sadmarsh said – “I was born in 1974 and I have known about McCarthy at least since I was 8.

    My reply – Dude, I was playing with salamanders, water skiing, and racing dirt bikes at 8.

    Your childhood sounds so un-happy. :(
    I’ll make you an appointment with Dr. Mumpower.
    You can talk about your childhood problems.
    You know……let it all out.

  27. Chad Nesbitt

    Lokel said – “And exactly how, Chad (and anyone else, out there), are you going to know who is illegal and who is not?”

    My reply – If people in the community tell you drugs are coming out of a particular house, women were being raped by gang members, or a child was being molested, would you call the police? I would hope you would. The police department would then decide the course of action.

  28. Chad Nesbitt

    Bill Barnwell said – “God bless you Dr Mumpower. Keep up the good fight for the people of Asheville, and the nation as a whole. Most of us appreciate it.”

    My reply – I agree Bill! Thank you for your comment. There are more of us common sense folks than these loud mouth liberals! Keep up the fight!

    And your right.
    That ACT is awful thin now days.

  29. Chad Nesbitt

    Brent said – “No, seriously. Your elephant is cross-eyed. You should have your designer fix it. Hell, I’d do it myself, if you weren’t such a blowhard.”

    My reply – Dude he’s not cross eyed.
    It’s the way you are looking at him.
    Go down to the Board of Elections and
    change from a D to an R.
    You will see much better.
    I promise you.

  30. Piffy!

    [b]Go down to the Board of Elections and
    change from a D to an R.
    You will see much better.
    I promise you.[/b]

    Dude, if you really think there is any significant difference between the D and R, you are as naive and silly as those you claim to oppose.

  31. Chad Nesbitt

    Ken Hanke said – “The conservatives around here are probably the best friends the Democratic party ever had.”

    My reply – Ken p l e a s e . . . .
    Just stick to the movie reviews. That’s the only place I can agree with you……sometimes. LOL.

  32. Chad Nesbitt

    The (PFKap),

    You awake to uh?

    Never thought of you as an independent.
    I thought you just liked to raise hell about me. LOL.

    Your right to an extent. But I beleive in the Republican platform. Stompers hold the RINO’s accounatable to you know. Read the platform.

    I’m going to bed. Car show in the morning.
    Going to dream of Elephants and Star trek.

  33. Ken Hanke

    My reply – Ken p l e a s e . . . .

    Chad, if you honestly think anything you do or say is helping your cause, keep doing it.

    Just stick to the movie reviews. That’s the only place I can agree with you……sometimes.

    You do realize that most of these movies you like are made by people of the Democrat persuasion, don’t you?

  34. shadmarsh

    Dude,

    you still haven’t figured out the whole you’re/your thing yet. Perhaps a bit too much time on the ol’ dirt bike as a youngn’? Or is proper usage of the English language too “intellectual” for your taste?

  35. entopticon

    The thing I love the most about the far right is that not only do they dig their own holes, they are always looking for a bigger and better shovel. They hit the mother-load with their embrace of McCarthyism.

    Apparently Chad discovered Joe McCarthy last week and he is already taking that dusty old government issue bulldozer shovel out for a spin. Carl and a handful of others on the extreme right already got a head-start with theirs.

    Amazingly, the full-blown ultra-right-wing fundamentalist extremist travelah even popped his head out of his murky hole to warn the other right-wing extremists not to back McCarthyism (in-between his usual ramblings about the President’s black Marxist conspiracies rooted in his Islamic middle name and “Obamunism”).

    Let’s do everything possible to make sure they don’t run ever out fuel because there is nothing more amusing than watching them dig themselves into oblivion…. Actually, what the heck am I worried about? –There is little danger of them ever running out of fuel for those bulldozer shovels because their gas mixture is a volatile combination of xenophobia and Machiavellian faery dust.

  36. shadmarsh writes: “How do you square the stance, of the government, or members thereof abusing their political office by compiling secret lists of people who have not been accused of any crime, with your so-called Libertarian “philosophy”? ”

    It is the proper role of the government to protect individual rights from violations, including those posed by foreign threats. My “philosophy” also respects the facts of reality. McCarthy was vindicated by the evidence. The facts show that foreign communists were indeed infiltrating the federal government and represented a threat to national security (which is also my security). It is the government’s job to investigate, combat and eliminate those threats. Would we we were as vigilant against the threat of Islamic Totalitarianism and other threats foreign and domestic.

    Thank you Dr. Mumpower for doing the jobs that Americans won’t do.

  37. You do realize that most of these movies you like are made by people of the Democrat persuasion, don’t you?

    Ok, I’ve been waiting for the STAR TREK review to bring this up, but I can’t wait any longer. This is off-topic.

    Chad, the Star Trek world exists with no money, free health care, non-exploitation of other worlds, and an idea that everyone works to advance the human race. That’s socialism.

    Deep down, are you hurting inside to be a left-winger?

  38. shadmarsh

    Tim,

    So anyone who is a Communist is a traitor? And you are confusing two seperate issues. Foreign goverments infiltrate our government all the time, how do you think Israel got itself some nukes? These people, thousands of them, were persecuted not because they were foreign agents, but because they held (or in some cases simply attended a meeting, or were related to people who did) political beliefs that were unpopular.

    Surely I would think someone of your own professed political leanings could see how endorsing such illegal and unconstitutional actions against citizens of this country simply because of there political affiliation might not be such a good idea…It baffles me that one who seems to be reasonably intelligent can be so obtuse.

  39. entopticon

    Gene Roddenberry was a self-described “humanist” and “agnostic atheist” that rejected his Southern Baptist upbringing and pictured a future free from the shackles of organized religion. He directed the people behind his Star Trek series to share in that vision for the show. How very un-Stomper-like of him.

    No one has yet to fully explain the ubiquitous phenomenon of right-wingers clinging to liberal culture and media. Granted, right-wingers don’t have much of a choice when it comes to things like music and art. There is only so much Ted Nugent and Thomas Kincaid that anyone can take.

    It is just fascinating that liberals spend most of their time trying to get away from right-wing culture, and right-wingers spend enormous energy leaching onto liberal hangouts, art, and media. The idea of hanging around a right-wing Christian rock concert, or hanging around a right-wing weekly’s website for that matter, sounds like hell on Earth to me.

    It’s certainly no coincidence that right-wing politicians keep getting sued every time they turn around by musicians that are furious that they have been using their songs in their campaign rallies. I guess Ted Nugent singing Wango-Tango just doesn’t make a very good campaign slogan, though it would probably be much more apt for most of them.

  40. Matt Howard

    I have to admit I have found Dr. Mumpower charming and likeable in my dealings with him. But defending McCarthy is never going to win you any points with the mainstream. His history is written.

    The democrats recent political success is due as much to the crazytown that right wingers live in as it is a charasmatic leader at the right time.
    Remember progressives: the key to continued success is to not go to your own crazytown.

  41. Chad Nesbitt

    Hanke / entopticon – this goes along with your comments to.

    Orbit DVD said – “Chad, the Star Trek world exists with no money, free health care, non-exploitation of other worlds, and an idea that everyone works to advance the human race. That’s socialism.”

    Oh now, this is wonderful. A socialist liberal trying to take on a Trekie.
    This conversation is becoming “really out there“! So be it.

    There exists no money and free health care in Star trek because of a thing called a Replicator. You ask for earl gray tea, it makes it. You ask for Romulan ale, it makes it.
    You ask for food, water, cloths, and medicine, it makes it. You better hope someone invents a Replicator fast so we can make money and pay back all the trillions Obama and the liberals are spending.

    Non-exploitation of other worlds and the idea that everyone works to advance the human race is an American, capitalist, freedom, Christian trait. It has nothing to do with socialism.

    The United States of America leads the world in technology and nurturing the poor.
    When other nations kill their own or threatens our way of life in America, we respond.
    Responding is not a take over of a country’s way of life. It is defending freedom and human rights.

    When disaster hits another nation, we are the first to respond with help.
    The United States believes in the advancement of all humans no matter what race you are.
    Millions of people from around the world leave communist, socialistic, and corrupt nations to come to the United States. They come here because of our freedom.

    The Borg is a socialist regime. The Borg tries to assimilate humans for their collective.
    It’s their way or they will try to destroy you.

    The Borg is the Democrat Party.
    The Borg is socialist.
    The Borg is communist.
    Obama is it’s leader.

  42. “Chad, the Star Trek world exists with no money, free health care, non-exploitation of other worlds, and an idea that everyone works to advance the human race. That’s socialism. ”

    Both the Star Trek world and socialism are fictitious conceptions unconnected to the facts of reality. Anytime either are implemented in the real world, they fail. Both are unsustainable.

  43. Oh now, this is wonderful. A socialist liberal trying to take on a Trekie.

    I don’t think I’ve stated my political leanings Chad. It’s definitely not what you are assuming.

  44. Piffy!

    “”*It’s their way or they will try to destroy you.* “”

    Umm, isnt that kinda your MO towards anyone who differs from you, as well?

    It’s funny how you project your own behavior onto those you label as “enemy”.

    Really, you might want to explore that a bit. It’s called self-reflection.

  45. Piffy!

    I am always astounded by the bad caricature of a Sly Stalone movie you portray yourself as Chad.

    Perhaps if you studied actual history, maybe even from multiple sources, instead of gleaming bits of it from Jean Claud Van Dam movies, you might have a more sober worldview that didnt include a hilariously Absurd notion of the United State’s of America’s role in the world.

    I bet it’s fun to pretend to be a cowboy, but, arent you in your 40’s? Maybe time to stop playing fort?

  46. tigerlily

    Funny how no one who uses “socialism” as a slam against liberals ever mentions the liberal social democracies in northern Europe (Sweden, Denmark, Norway) and how peaceful, prosperous and succussful they are, and with an exemplary quality of life.

    And, oh yeah, they are capitalist as well as socially progressive. The problem with most political debate in America is that we know less about the rest of the world now than we did 250 years ago…

  47. Chad since you only recently learned about Joseph McCarthy, you might want to flesh out your research by looking up his sidekick Roy Cohn. That knowledge will be sure to enhance your elephant dreams.

  48. shadmarsh

    He’s Roy Cohn’s wet dream. I think they would have gotten along fabulously.

  49. Ken Hanke

    Yep, the conservatives hereabouts are the best friend the Democrats ever had.

    Chad, you haven’t even addressed the actual issue of the intentions of those who made Star Trek. Nattering on about “the replicator” is just a pipe-dream dodge. The shows and the movies are still largely made by left-leaning liberal Democrat types. Roddenberry’s self-professed non-religious humanistic is still the thematic center of the whole thing. You might wish that they’d all line up to join the Stompers and support your vision of what America “ought to be,” but it has little to do with reality.

  50. entopticon

    I actually think Chad’s comparison of the Borg to communism is rational. The collective over the individual analogy is fair.

    That said, it is more than a bit ironic for a Republican to compare Democrats to the Borg; especially Republicans who criticize multiculturalism, call this a “Christian nation,” criticize people speaking Spanish in a country named after Amerigo Vespucci, and do everything in their power to promote cultural hegemony.

    If you had a rational bone in your body you would know that it is more than a bit nuts to criticize Democrats for multiculturalism out of one side of your mouth while comparing them to the Borg out of the other side. You can’t have it both ways.

    The Borg represent hegemony, and that is an area that the Republicans have completely cornered the market on. Like Chad, Carl, and the Republicans, the Borg want one culture, one language, one spiritual system, etc, etc, etc. Like the Republicans, the Borg have no place for multiculturalism. Like the Republicans, the Borg won’t be happy till they spread their cultural hegemony to every corner of the known world.

    Of course, if Ayn Randian self-interest is the metric, then Republicans would best be represented by Klingons in the Star Trek World.

    Whatever the case is, there is not a rational case to be made that the socialistic, atheistic, secular humanism of the future imagined by Gene Roddenberry in any way reflects the basic tenets of the far right wing.

  51. Nattering on about “the replicator” is just a pipe-dream dodge.

    Was this also only in The Next Generation? I don’t think that the original Star Trek had a replicator.

    I remember seeing an episode where a 20th century investor was thawed out and was having a hard time coming to grips with the lack of money and investments in the future. I’ll try to find the name and plot synopsis.

  52. travelah

    Trying to tie Star Trek in with Mumpower and McCarthyism is a lot like building a case for Calvinistic theology out of the Matrix trilogy. It’s Hollywood, you know, where dreams are made and reality is in another world.

  53. Ken Hanke

    Trying to tie Star Trek in with Mumpower and McCarthyism is a lot like building a case for Calvinistic theology out of the Matrix trilogy. It’s Hollywood, you know, where dreams are made and reality is in another world.

    In terms of talking about things like “the replicator,” yes. In terms of discussing a particular ideology, not so much. Then again, it always seems to me that Chad’s reality is in another world.

  54. entopticon

    It occurred to me that over the years I’ve spoken to two Star Trek consultants a few times; Jack Sarfatti and Fred Alan Wolf, two San Francisco liberals that make me look pretty conservative by comparison.

    The nutty scientist character in the Back To The Future series was loosely based on Sarfatti, a notable physicist and consciousness researcher that incorporates Timothy Leary’s ideas in his work. Sarfatti once told me that he wants to be a blue collar quantum mechanic.

    Fred Alan Wolf is one of the foremost voices on quantum theories of mind. He is best known for his interviews in What the Bleep. Wolf told me about his ideas about parallel universes years before they were widely accepted in the scientific world.

    Sarfatti and Wolf both provide commentary on time travel on the Star Trek IV dvd. Here is an old pic of the two of them looking very un-stomper-like indeed:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Sarfatti-Wolf.jpg

  55. Piffy!

    ” It’s Hollywood, you know, where dreams are made and reality is in another world.”

    Much like Crazy Carl!

  56. Matt Howard

    Here’s where I reveal my true nature:

    There were no replicaters in original Trek. And the episode with the freaked out investment banker was the season finalie from the first season. Also the 1st appearance the Romulans in next gen, and the first episode to hint at the existence of the Borg.

  57. travelah

    Sarfatti and Wolf are prime examples of what occurs to relatively intelligent souls when they ingest too many drugs. Mumpower would have a personal orgy looking into their thought processes. Speaking of Mumpower,does he actually have a constituency that constitutes a viable run for higher office? He strikes me as a lone fringe candidate

  58. entopticon

    “Sarfatti and Wolf are prime examples of what occurs to relatively intelligent souls when they ingest too many drugs.”

    They become renowned quantum physicists?!? They consult on abstruse issues in quantum physics for Hollywood blockbusters and regularly appear on the Discovery channel to share their expertise? They lecture at some of the top universities in the world? Heavens to Murgatroid!

    Sounds like a healthy dose of psychedelic drugs might be just what you need travelah.

  59. Bjorn

    Politicians (like mumpower) have to be treated like wayward children. As politics is simply an incurable disease.

  60. travelah

    A couple of the smartest people I have ever met were also mad hatters with some really lunatic ideas. They were thoroughly fried. As for myself, I walked away from such indulgences over 30 years ago.

  61. Rhonda Velour

    I am a liberal and did not vote for Carl Mumpower. I do respect him though because he has guts and stands up for what he believes. I wish more liberals were like that.

  62. bobaloo

    Only on the Xpress blogs would a piece on illegal immigration = McCarthyism turn into a discussion of the ideological points of Star Trek.

  63. entopticon

    It certainly is entertaining to see ultra-right-wing evangelical extremists such as travelah take potshots at Mumpower’s political career. The crackpot fringe of the far right continues to tear itself apart piece by piece.

  64. Chad Nesbitt

    boobaloo said – “Only on the Xpress blogs would a piece on illegal immigration = McCarthyism turn into a discussion of the ideological points of Star Trek.”

    LOL:) I didn’t start it. These guy’s did –
    Hanke, entopticon, and Orbit DVD

    Live long and prosper.

    Hey, by the way –
    “Prosper”. That word that Spock say’s is a perfect example that Star Trek has nothing to do with socialism. You can not “prosper” under a socialistic government. The only one that is “prospering” is the government.

  65. Chad Nesbitt

    Rhonda Velour said – “I am a liberal and did not vote for Carl Mumpower. I do respect him though because he has guts and stands up for what he believes.”

    Thank you for this comment Rhonda.

  66. travelah

    entoptee, everybody to your immediate right is on the ultra right wing fringe since of course there is a huge gaping hole from the edge of your right pinkie toe to the edge of sanity. Close that screen door.

  67. Chad Nesbitt

    Matt Howard said –
    “Here’s where I reveal my true nature:

    There were no replicaters in original Trek. And the episode with the freaked out investment banker was the season finalie from the first season. Also the 1st appearance the Romulans in next gen, and the first episode to hint at the existence of the Borg.”

    Matt, there were replicators on the original Star trek – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Udpjgnux22o
    They just tasted better in TNG.

    The first appearance of Romulans was not in the Next Gen. It was in the original series –
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34mEP-qW1nk

    And to relate this information to the current topic – McCarthy was not a Borg. He was an American. He just pointed out the Borg.
    :)LOL.

    Illegal aliens do not cross the Neutral Zone. They cross the Mexico / United States border.

    My suggestion to stop illegal immigration –
    Send in the Klingons!
    LOL.:p

  68. entopticon

    Actually travelah, the right-wing is indeed being pushed to the radical fringes by fundamentalist crackpots. Thank you for the fine work. By all means, keep it up.

    As for your persistent dissing of Candler with all of your remarks about shutting the screen door of my trailer, blah-blah-blah…

    I’ve actually been fortunate to do pretty well for myself with a little old house on a dozen acres of paradise, but some of my neighbors here do live in trailers and in my experience they are very fine people.

    As a matter of fact, an old friend of mine, a former BU professor who used to run a forum on the intersection cognitive neuroscience and the arts with me, now lives right down the road here in Candler. Before moving here he was in a MIT/BU think tank among other things. Over a decade ago we co-curated a joint project with MIT’s Center for Advanced Visual Studies. His wife, a dear old friend of mine as well, is from an old NC family with a town named after them out towards Charlotte.

    By the way, fundamentalist evangelical practitioners of a 2000 year old Roman cult that worships an angry magical giant that floats around in the sky while meddling in the outcomes of football games probably shouldn’t go pointing fingers when it comes to sanity.

  69. entopticon

    Again Chad, no matter how you slice it, the Borg represented cultural hegemony, which is something the right-wing has cornered the market on. Like the GOP, the Borg had no room for the multiculturalism of the left.

    Every “Welcome to America, Now Speak English” bumper sticker is a sobering reminder of the Borgian cultural hegemony of the far right.

  70. travelah

    entoptee, Candler is a fine little community. What does that have to do with your problems?

  71. Chad Nesbitt

    Seriously,
    I have had fun with you guy’s in this comment section.

    Those of you that have lost your job to an illegal alien, please contact me at the Carolina Stompers.

    Those of you that are legal immigrants and took the time to learn what America is about, God Bless You. I know it’s not fair for you to go through learning what our country is about, learning to speak English, and learning our history to have an illegal alien strip you of your hard work and freedoms. It’s not fair to the Americans that were born here either.

    America calls on all races. We scream freedom!
    We want every human to enjoy our freedoms and pursuit of happiness. But to be a free American means learning our laws, our constitution, and your responsibilities to that American dream.

  72. Chad Nesbitt

    shadmarsh,

    Now dude that was funny. LOL.

    It’s the spelling not the speaking that I have a problem with. I told you guy’s I was dyslexic.
    Just be glad everything is not written sdrawkcab.
    :)

  73. entopticon

    Yeah travelah, I’m sure that’s what your Candler trailer cracks are about. I don’t live in a trailer, I live in an expanded old Craftsman so that trailer crack you keep making certainly isn’t about me. You sure do have a lot of trouble keeping your lies straight.

  74. entopticon

    Stomper Borg #1 said: “Attention all aliens, you will be assimilated.”

  75. bobaloo

    You know, that reminds me. The other day I was sitting on the porch with an old friend of mine from UC Berkeley grad school. He had just finished up a lecture series at Cambridge concerning hybrids of silicon technology and biological molecular machines. Anyway, we were discussing nanoelectromechanical relaxation oscillators and their viability which of course led to an argument over the success of the experiments by Ho and Lee at Cornell, which I had a hand in. It was saucy, I tell you.

    Ah, good times here in Weaverville.

  76. Chad Nesbitt

    Bobaloo,

    So who won the argument?

    Jus kid.
    I know. It’s getting a little nerdy in here is’n it?

  77. entopticon

    Nanoelectromechanical relaxation oscillator? That may be the most inventive name that I’ve ever heard for a blow-up doll.

  78. Ken Hanke

    LOL:) I didn’t start it. These guy’s did –
    Hanke, entopticon, and Orbit DVD

    Well, sort of. You’re the one who suggested I stick to movie reviews.

    I told you guy’s I was dyslexic.

    Neither spelling, nor dyslexia accounts for your claim ages ago that some people think you’re a “religious zelick.”

  79. brebro

    Do the legal aliens who had to pass a test to learn about America know who Joe McCarthy is?

  80. Well, sort of. You’re the one who suggested I stick to movie reviews.

    I’ll take full blame for hijacking this thread… I couldn’t wait until Wednesday.

    Have you seen “The Neutral Zone” episode Chad?

  81. shadmarsh

    Anyone else find it funny that millions of immigrants are able to overcome the hardship of moving to a new country and learning a new language and customs, and don’t use it as an excuse, yet Ol’ Chad here drops the dyslexia excuse every chance he gets?

    I can tell ya Chad, from personal experience, overcoming the difficulties of dyslexia only takes a bit of hard work. If it is so good for everyone else, why aren’t you willing to give it a try?

  82. Piffy!

    “Neither spelling, nor dyslexia accounts for your claim ages ago that some people think you’re a “religious zelick.””

    A lack of knowledge of the English Language can, though.

  83. travelah

    “Nanoelectromechanical relaxation oscillator? That may be the most inventive name that I’ve ever heard for a blow-up doll.”

    … er .. I am guessing you have your own fond pet names for your toys.

  84. entopticon

    Actually no travelah, as usual, you are projecting. I guess you need something to fill your time between getting publicly humiliated for your lies and chickening out of sharing your personal info even after you asked the same of me. It’s kind of like your asinine theory that gay people can be cured of being gay. Projection. Look into it. And give those toys of yours a rest. You’ll save a fortune on batteries and you won’t have to keep coming up with “fond pet names” for them.

  85. travelah

    Why would I share my personal information with you?? You are one creepy deranged dude :)

  86. entopticon

    Because you asked me countless times to share my personal info here and on countless occasions you even berated me for making anonymous claims. That makes you an unconscionable hypocrite and coward. Do I have to quote you to humiliate you even further?

    You even cyber-stalked me and tracked down my myspace and facebook profiles you stalking freak. I hope you didn’t get too much use out of those sex toys that you give fond pet names in the process.

    If you were a true Christian you wouldn’t have asked (over and over and over again) for something that you aren’t willing to give yourself. Your bible commands against that. As Chad might say, that makes you a CINO.

    To be honest, you make Chad look like a rocket scientist and a pillar of integrity by comparison. At least Chad tries to be honest, though not always consistent. I busted you red-handed in flat out lies for everyone here to see, and instead of begging for forgiveness like any normal person you just got even snottier because you are too dense to even understand how profoundly humiliated you have been.

    Every time you chicken out of the very thing that you asked of me countless times you will only be reminded of the profound depths of your cowardice.

    “cluck-cluck-cluck.”

  87. Rhonda Velour

    “Why would I share my personal information with you?? You are one creepy deranged dude :)”

    You are so right Mr Traveler. Anyone who constantly calls those he disagrees with “liar” and “coward”, certainly has a screw loose. So why bother conversing with him?

  88. lydia see

    ok. first of all, after this whole conversation, Chad still doesn’t seem to get the possessive comma thing :
    I told you guy’s I was dyslexic. and if he writes LOL one more time, I’m gonna scream.

    second of all, never have I seen such malicious content on the MountainX forums.

    To be honest, you make Chad look like a rocket scientist and a pillar of integrity by comparison. At least Chad tries to be honest, though not always consistent. I busted you red-handed in flat out lies for everyone here to see, and instead of begging for forgiveness like any normal person you just got even snottier because you are too dense to even understand how profoundly humiliated you have been.
    for example.

    why doesn’t everyone take a huge deep breath, go see the new Star Trek, and then do a little light reading from another source than Wikipedia on McCarthy? (except for you Chad, I think you need to read the Wiki article again, SLOWER this time: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mccarthyism)
    oh, p.s. you’re all a bunch of Sympathizers. Health care for all, neutral nation, pah!

  89. travelah

    Poor entoptee …. I am under no obligation to share a thing with you. I’ve made no claims or boasts that require disclosing anything at all to you. In fact, anybody who would share anything with you should not be trusted around family pets and small children. It is that simple. Those mature participants on the boards and forums who have discussed matters with me off-line know my name. It is no secret with them. Now, looking at a public myspace page created by yourself touting your good and kind persona isn’t exactly stalking, is it? However, immediately making it private when the absurd niceties you plastered all over it about yourself are mentioned in contrast with your conduct here is .. er .. paranoid? I don’t know .. what’s the word?

    I think your entertainment factor is running out of juice and it’s time to leave you to your ranting lunacy … rave on!

  90. Piffy!

    Funny, i had a post removed from this thread.

    Interesting, since off-topic-entop’s lunacy remains.

  91. John

    PFKaP – Trav and Entop’s traveling Jerry Springer episode must boost ratings.

  92. entopticon

    I didn’t invite you to those pages travelah. There was no certainly no link from here. You had to do a little cyber-stalking to get there. The electronic equivalent of following me home from the supermarket.

    However you slice it, you asked me countless times to share my personal info, and even criticized me countless times for being anonymous, and that makes you unconscionably hypocritical. That’s all there is to it.

    If you can’t understand that chickening out of something that you asked of someone else countless times is disgracefully hypocritical, you are even denser than I imagined. Squirm as you might, there is no defense because I asked nothing of you that you didn’t ask of me.

    Now until you grow a pair, I will try to keep my responses to you to a minimum.

    “cluck-cluck-cluck-cluck”

  93. entopticon

    Really R2D2? My lunacy? As opposed to yours?

    Are you honestly THAT slow and/or deranged that the hypocritical irony of going off-topic to whine about people going off topic is completely lost on you? Amazing.

    It’s particularly ironic because you go off topic on a regular basis and aside from your embarrassingly juvenile and excruciatingly clique theory about how there is no real difference between R’s and D’s, your posts on this thread were all just less than witty ad hominem attacks that had little to do with the actual issue. You certainly didn’t offer any actual insight into the issue. Not that you ever do.

  94. Bill Barnwell

    Funny. It looks to me like this ‘the pfk’ person gets off subject as much or more than anyone else. Funny how people tend to project on others, isn’t it?

    Now, for Dr Carl. Love the guy. He has the courage of his convictions. Glad he is serving on the City Council to balance off some of the silly ‘progressives’.

  95. travelah

    … waiting for the next lunatic froth ….

    Do the critics of Mumpower have anything they like or agree with him on at all?

  96. John

    Carl was for the Chickens. That is a progressive movement … except for the vegans, who of course, hate the idea.

  97. entopticon

    Lydia, you were ragging on a dyslexic person’s writing skills and yet you had the hypocritical audacity to call me malicious for standing up for my self and speaking the truth. Your hypocrisy is astounding. Dyslexic people almost always have trouble with punctuation as well because the entire process is very difficult for them. What’s next, are you going to make fun of people in wheel chairs for not standing? You can say whatever you want. but you sure as hell have no business calling me malicious. At least I wasn’t slamming people for their handicaps.

    I make no bones about the fact that if I am attacked I will respond harshly, but at least I’m not a hypocrite. travelah spent a year here lying to people, telling them that he had proven me to be a fraud, saying that he had researched an academic journal that I claimed to had written in and proved that I was lying. He taunted me to give my personal info countless times and I resisted, but recently I proved that he was lying all along once and for all. Personally I think he should have begged for forgiveness after being exposed for bearing false witness against me all that time. It’s certainly what anyone with a conscience would have done. So sue me.

  98. Chad Nesbitt

    SINCE WE ARE OFF TOPIC!
    BREAKING NEWS!

    Miss California keeps her crown!
    LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL!
    Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha!

    Obama agrees –
    Marriage should be between a man and a woman only!
    LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL!
    Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha!

    OK, OK, OK. Just rubbing it in!
    I couldn’t resist!

    HA, HA, HA! It’s a great news day!

  99. shadmarsh

    Are you sure you weren’t born in 1996 and not 1970? Or are you just perpetually 12 years old?

  100. John

    Why does it consistently take an hour for my posts to show up when Trav and Entop seem to get posted in real time? It totally lets the air out of my jokes.

  101. travelah

    Chad, it’s the middle of the day for cripes sake. Have you no shame?

  102. travelah

    “… waiting for the next lunatic froth ..”

    Sure didn’t have to wait long.

  103. entopticon

    When are right-wing extremists going to finally realize that their obsessive objections to gay relationships make their own sexual confusion blatantly obvious?

    travelah believes that gay people can be “cured” because he is desperately trying to cure his own sexual confusion. Same for Chad. If they weren’t wrestling with their own demons, they would care less what gay people do with each other and they certainly wouldn’t think homosexuality is a sin.

    There are those of us on both ends of the spectrum who have no choice. People such as travelah and Chad chose to live a straight lifestyle despite their same sex attraction, and that is why they project their choice onto others.

    And this brings us back to the topic of the thread. The two key figures in McCarthy’s insane witch hunt were Roy Cohn and J. Edgar Hoover, both of whom used McCarthyism to lash out against homosexuals (not just communists) because they were so confused about their own same sex attraction.

    It is beyond ironic that J Edgar Hoover not-so-secretly liked to dress up in women’s clothing and have sex with men despite his malicious targeting of homosexuals. Roy Cohn’s hypocrisy was just as bad. Even on his deathbed, dying of AIDS, Cohn denied he had AIDS.

    Today Hoover and Cohn have been replaced by people like Larry Craig who use public policy to lash out at gay culture because they can’t come to terms with their own sexual preferences.

    A film called Outrage that is about to be released is on this subject:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgESXQccWi8

    When travelah and Chad come to terms with their sexual identity issues, they will finally stop directing their venom at the gay community.

  104. John

    I personally feel that there should prob be gay marriage. If you are born with that sexual orientation, discriminating against it presents ethical issues. Churches can do what they want, I’m talking the gov’t.

    However:

    “When are right-wing extremists going to finally realize that their obsessive objections to gay relationships make their own sexual confusion blatantly obvious?”

    Obama, Biden, Hillary and vast majorities of the hispanic and african-american communities believe marriage should be between a man and a woman.

    Are they right wing extremists? Why do they get a complete pass? It makes sense to me that focusing on those within the democratic party would be more productive for the cause than those who will obviously never change their mind.

    What’s up with that?

  105. shadmarsh

    John,

    Become a registered user and your comments will appear automatically.

  106. Jon Elliston

    John:

    We’ll get your posting status changed within the next day or so, so your comments will start appearing immediately instead of being moderated.

    Jon Elliston
    Mountain Xpress

  107. entopticon

    John, that’s a legitimate question. The fact is that politicians on both side have to make pragmatic decisions based on political realities. The right-wing uses gay marriage as a wedge issue during every election cycle in order to exploit homophobia in order to get people to vote against their own interests, i.e., tax cuts for the rich.

    Obama’s a politician. For better or worse, he took a piecemeal approach to improving rights for the gay community rather than fully supporting gay marriage because there is a good chance he wouldn’t have gotten elected otherwise. Politicians make concessions. If they don’t they are just sanctimonious windbags.

    If he had lost it would have meant continuing the insanely catastrophic catastrophic environmental, economic, and military consequences of the far right. As recent events show, gay rights have increased more under Obama than at any other time in American history. Of course there is still a long way to go, and Obama has another election to win still.

    The far right will continue their effective and amoral demonization of gays, feminists, and people of color, and scapegoating immigrants and “welfare mothers” for all of America’s problems so the political realities of that battle will haunt us for a long time to come.

  108. entopticon

    The more I think about it, it really is hilarious that the Borg and the far right have the exact same slogan, “You will be assimilated!”

    “Gays must be straight, only English must be spoken, this is a Christian nation, blah-blah-blah”

    Thank you for that hilarious link Chad. Now I am even more revolted by that vacuous windbag. Boo-frickin-hoo. Watching her cry over being called out for her shameful bigotry was a riot.

    She still doesn’t get that no one said that she doesn’t have a right to her bigoted and shamefully ignorant opinions; that doesn’t mean that the rest of us don’t have the right to condemn her bigotry. She can’t have it both ways.

    It wasn’t that long ago that black people weren’t allowed to get married in this country either. I don’t doubt that a few of the people on the extreme right here wish that was still the case.

    As aforementioned Chad, Hoover and Cohn seemed to find that having sex with men took some of the anxiety out of their homophobic witch hunt for McCarthy. Does it work for you too?

  109. entopticon

    By the way, I 100% agree with Chad on the Palin/Prejean candidacy! Watching dimwitted religious fanatics like them hijack the GOP is beyond enjoyable.

  110. travelah

    I agree with Obama with his position of legitimizing civil unions for homosexual couples. The State has no particular interest in trying to manage the sexual relationships between consenting adults. I think that is Dick Cheney’s position as well.

  111. John

    What is the difference between marriage and a civil union from a gov’t standpoint?

  112. John

    My point on the Obama/gay marriage thing was really focused more on the media and their love affair with their man. Here they are focusing on a dupe … a pagaent queen … acting like she’s a heretic and lone wolf on this issue. If they had any stones or integrity, they’d be putting pressure on the administration now that he’s in office. I bet that even if he gets a second term, they’d give him a pass then too.

  113. travelah

    John, from a practical perspective, there is no difference between marriage and a civil union. Both provide the civil protections of a spouse. There has to be another objective that the homosexual activist lobby is seeking rather than civil protections. I believe it is an attempt to force cultural and ethical acceptance upon a population that is not agreeable to such. It is one thing to condone and be tolerant of and it is something else altogether to accept as ethically and morally correct.
    I was listening to a talk show host on my drive home this evening. I cannot recall who he was but he made a very valid point. The homosexual lobby is a tiny and insignificant constituency compared to the black and hispanic electorate. Obama is not going to expend his political capital on the homosexuals if it costs him anything in his core constituencies. The result will be continued noise and distasteful disruptions (i.e. Perez Hilton).

  114. entopticon

    As usual, travelah spouts a bunch of offensive garbage about something that he clearly knows absolutely nothing about. His claim that there is no difference from a practical perspective is a flat-out lie. There is a an extensive list of ways that civil unions are far inferior to the benefits and protections of marriage:
    http://www.now.org/issues/marriage/marriage_unions.html

    Even Obama has repeatedly said that in order for civil unions to be fair they must be rewritten to have virtually identical protections and benefits as marriage. As of now, it is nowhere close.

    The homosexual activist lobby?!? Accept it as morally and ethically correct? I’m sure it would be possible for you to be even more offensive somehow, but it would certainly be no small task.

  115. John

    Trav – do you think that all that are gay choose to be and that there is no physical difference?

  116. travelah

    definition of entopticon: a microcosm of CO2 induced global warming.

  117. entopticon

    There are few things more hilarious than right-wing extremist attempts to deny global warming.

    If anyone seriously thinks that it is just a coincidence that two of the primary architects of McCarthyism were repressed homosexuals that lashed out against the homosexual community needs to have their head examined.

    And if you think that the two most vocal antigay right-wing extremists here, Chad and travelah don’t have similar issues, yoou need to have your head examined as well.

    The Larry Craigs, and travelahs, and Chad Nesbitts, and Ted Haggards of the world are so obsessed with oppressing gay people because of their own sexual identity issues, but they still don’t realize how blatantly obvious that is to the rest of us.

  118. lydia see

    entopticon –
    “Your hypocrisy is astounding. Dyslexic people almost always have trouble with punctuation as well because the entire process is very difficult for them. ”
    I am lysdexic, too. A lot of people do. They usually don’t use it as an excuse. I wasn’t making fun of his dyslexia, but rather his mentioning it. Chad’s choice to continually add an apostrophe isn’t anything related to his dyslexia, obviously, or he would have used the dyslexia excuse after the sixth comment from “listen to you, why” where the apostrophe ‘s’ was first mentioned. but no, he continues with:
    “Obama is a communist. Here’s googles definiton”
    and [in case you need help, Google should have ‘s on the end] “And your right.
    That ACT is awful thin now days.” [should be “you’re” for “you are”]
    Instead, Chad doesn’t mention his dyslexia until much later, when it’s convenient for his argument.

    “You can say whatever you want. but you sure as hell have no business calling me malicious. At least I wasn’t slamming people for their handicaps.”

    No, you weren’t. You were slamming someone for something that happened how long ago? Years? totally off-topic to the content of the feed? I was merely attempting to lighten things up a bit. It’s interesting to me that you take yourself so seriously, and everyone else writing here seems to have somewhat of a sense of humor and realize that, hey, it’s an opinion forum following a local political article. On the internet.

    I think it’s awesome when the community in Asheville is mobilized to have discourse relevant to such an enthralling topic, and I really enjoy reading a lot of what is posted here on MountainX by Asheville Folk, when related to the topic at hand. Rarely do I comment, but I was compelled due to the bevy of personal stabs you and Chad were both making at other people. So I just decided to give you a little of your own medicine, that is all.

    For everyone else, I appreciate your opinions and humor, even finding a way to relate Star Trek without being TOO off topic, Orbit.

    And remember, it’s only the internet, you can always go ride your bike.

    For what it’s worth, I think a little socialism never hurt anyone, it would be nice to have unified health care, though not homosexual, I think I would be ok with civil union, since all the important stuff is covered (owning property, banking, tax breaks), and I’m not down with “Illegal Witch Hunts” and am confused as to how you would be able to identify the difference between legal American Citizens and Aliens. Perhaps we should all start wearing yellow patches on our coat lapels so it’s easier to cart off those who do not belong.. Wait a minute, that sounds too familiar.

  119. Piffy!

    John,

    Everyone who doesnt agree with entop 100% is a “right-wing extremist”.

    Dont take it personally.

  120. Piffy!

    Now, I know this will get me labeled as a lunatic, hypocritical fringe right wing lunatic LIAR!!!!!, but…

    Anyone want to see if they can get entop layed?

    He would appear to really need it.

  121. Piffy!

    “C3pO, you are full of crap. ”

    You forgot to call me a LIAR!!!!!!! in all caps.

    not to mention a hypocrite or a purveyor of “Clique” ideals.

  122. Piffy!

    Entop,

    Do you ever get tired being at war with EVERYONE ALL THE TIME?

  123. entopticon

    (RU486)… I hope no one has ever accused you of cleverness, because they would be lying. Are you a teenager, or just developmentally stunted? Dude. Dudey-dude-dudey. Dude-o. Dude-o-rama. Like hey, get laid dude.

    I’m married. To a pretty remarkable woman actually. Methinks you are projecting. As a matter of fact, I would bet that your unusual lack of intelligence and complete lack of wit makes you quite unsuccessful in that department. The truth stings a bit, now doesn’t it?

  124. entopticon

    (Y2K) Where did I accuse you of lying? I accused travelah of lying because he claimed over and over again that he proved that I was a fraud who lied about being published in a particular journal and about having degrees. I provided relative info and irrefutably proved that he was lying.

    I suppose this is where if I were you, I would start a hissyfit about how many off-topic posts you have made. At least many of mine hae been on topic, unlike you. Your hypocrisy really is hilariously funny. I only regret that you are a bit too dense to get that.

    No, I don’t get tired of being honest. Have you even read your own posts? Virtually all of your posts are you at war with virtually everyone here. Your astonishing lack of introspection combined with your obsessive compulsion to project your flaws is particularly amusing because of your complete inability to recognize your own hypocrisy.

  125. Piffy!

    entop- Have you even read *your* own posts? Nearly all of your posts are you at war with everyone here. Your astonishing lack of introspection combined with your obvious compulsion to project your flaws is particularly amusing because of your complete inability to recognize your own irrelevance.

  126. entopticon

    Yes (R2d2) I have read my posts. How very original of you. Did you think that up all by yourself champ? No, of course you didn’t, because you are a walking clique without an original thought in your head.

    Tell me, are all these incessant, dimwitted personal attacks on me on topic? Gosh, they aren’t now are they? That makes you quite the hypocrite, now doesn’t it? Or is it only my off-topic posts that are a problem? Amazingly you still don’t get it. Thanks for the entertainment.

  127. clique (klk, klk)
    n.
    A small exclusive group of friends or associates.
    intr.v. cliqued, cliqu·ing, cliques Informal
    To form, associate in, or act as a clique.

    cli·ché also cliche (kl-sh)
    n.
    1. A trite or overused expression or idea: “Even while the phrase was degenerating to cliché in ordinary public use . . . scholars were giving it increasing attention” Anthony Brandt.
    2. A person or character whose behavior is predictable or superficial: “There is a young explorer . . . who turns out not to be quite the cliche expected” John Crowley.

  128. entopticon

    Ahh, I see Lydia. I used the wrong word. Sorry about that. I actually know that it’s cliche, but used the wrong word anyways for some reason. I actually use the wrong word quite a bit and make plenty of mistakes in my writing. Among my many flaws, a degenerative brain disease makes me pretty spacey sometimes. Maybe you could make fun of that next; it’s even funnier than dyslexia. Or perhaps we could play scrabble sometime.

  129. travelah

    John,
    There may be a natural tendency among individuals for certain behaviors but I don’t know if we should state there is a genetic disposition for homosexuality. Can we identify family histories of homosexuals in the same manner as noted among some alcoholics? I do not have the answer but I do know that many former alcoholics have beaten the desire for alcohol. Of course that raises the question of whether I equate the two and from my own Christian perspective, I do regard both as sin. Yet, sin is the natural condition of fallen man from our theological perspective. In other words it is the normal expectation and the reason why rational Christians should not be in the demonization game regarding homosexuality and other non-victim personal behaviors.

  130. entopticon

    Actually Lydia, your sanctimonious rants just dig you in deeper. Take potshots at Chad’s punctuation all you want. Knock yourself out, but your claim that it certainly doesn’t have anything to do with dyslexia is either dishonest or just plain ignorant.

    Good for you if you have worked your way past mild dyslexia. For a lot of people it makes the entire act of learning to write overwhelming; spelling, punctuation, grammar, syntax, and the whole shebang. Any way you slice it, you were making fun of Chad for the shortcomings related to his learning disabilities. Again, that’s your business. Chad insults plenty of people, so I’m not going to lose sleep over it, but you certainly have no business calling me malicious.

    “I was merely attempting to lighten things up a bit.”

    Golly, you are a riot.

    “So I just decided to give you a little of your own medicine, that is all.”

    Ditto.

  131. travelah

    Lydia, … and he is loving and kind too .. he says so on his myspace page.

  132. John

    Teege – Yes the ‘friendly’ poker game where everybody just happened to have tons of money in their pockets. My game is like that.

  133. When it all comes down to the nuts and bolts of things, I believe almost everyone you pass on the street has “ADD” or “Dyslexia” or “a degenerative brain disease”. Actually, come to think of it, my mom has Dysautonomia, a degenerative disease of the neurological system affecting her heart and brain. She has trouble pronouncing words correctly and with spelling and punctuation as well.

    The difference, here, Dr. Octagon, is that neither she, nor I (re: Dyslexia), nor many other people I know with Depression or learning disabilities or.. what is that disease where you don’t speak English or have a SS#..? Oh yeah, Illegalia, (those fuckers are highly contagious, by the way. Did you know that it transmits through saliva! Be Careful! [oh gawd I really hope that most of the people here know that I’m kidding, right?]).. These people usually don’t blame things that are in no way related to or a by-product of their disability on their disability. Honestly, it’s making more of a mockery of it in doing so. In fact, most people I know with a disability try to do as much as they can to AVOID mentioning it or talking about it.

    You and Chad both remind me of the kids in High School that cut themselves and then ask people if they want to see their scars.

  134. entopticon

    Lydia, you really are a seriously twisted person and you certainly like to talk a lot of crap. Everybody on the street has a degenerative brain disease? WTF is wrong with you? Do you rag on your mother as well?

    Are you handicapped, or do you just like speaking for handicapped people and making fun of them? If a legless person explains that having no legs limits their activity do you berate them for it too? Are they making a mockery of their illness if they don’t try to hide it too? It’s you that is making a mockery… of reason and humanity.

    Plenty of dyslexic people will cite their dyslexia for why they have trouble writing well, and they certainly don’t need you judging them for it.

    “You and Chad both remind me of the kids in High School that cut themselves and then ask people if they want to see their scars.”

    Seriously, your ignorance and cruelty borders on monstrous. It is beyond ironic that you called me malicious. Kids who are cutting themselves are almost always kids that have been through extreme physical and/or emotional abuse. And your response is to berate them for it?!? What the hell is wrong with you? Your sanctimonious bs really is unconscionable.

  135. entopticon

    Sorry The (TCBY), you ninja wordsmith you… It was supposed to say you are a walking cliché. My not-so-terrific brain mixed the words up. It happens sometimes. I bet you would kick my ass in Scrabble because you are just so clever.

  136. Chad Nesbitt

    Since were still all on topic……….

    GOOD MORNING!
    IT’S ANOTHER GREAT NEWS DAY!

    BREAKING NEWS – APA revises ‘gay gene’ theory –
    http://www.onenewsnow.com/Culture/Default.aspx?id=528376

    DAMNNNNNNN…..

    Let’s read that again –

    BREAKING NEWS – APA revises ‘gay gene’ theory –
    http://www.onenewsnow.com/Culture/Default.aspx?id=528376

    DAMNNNNNNN…..

    Like I always said –
    Being gay is a choice, not a civil right.
    You are not born gay and science
    now backs that up.

    Oh my! What are you liberals going to do?

    Just sayin.

    Have a happy day! :)

  137. entopticon

    Chad, I have never doubted that it is a choice for you. I don’t doubt for one second that you feel panicked and confused about the tingly feeling that you get when you think about lumberjacks or the Washington monument, and that is why you are so obsessed with trying to prove that it’s a choice for others as well.

    The problem is, you are projecting. Instead of beating yourself up over the fact that you crave sex with men, but choose to be with a woman because of your religion, you should consider yourself lucky. I envy people like you, who have a choice.

    Some of us have no choice whatsoever. Unlike you, I certainly couldn’t choose to be attracted to a man, so I know for a fact thaqt your argument is nonsense. That’s the case for many gays and lesbians as well. They have no more choice to be attracted to the opposite sex than I have to be attracted to the same sex.

    Sorry Chad, but it’s an obvious fact that because you are attracted to men, but you choose not to act on your attractions, you are projecting your choice onto the rest of us. Trust me, if you weren’t attracted to men, you would know that it’s not a choice for many of us.

    I once heard an evangelical say that preachers always preach the loudest about their own issues. That is clearly what is going on here. If you weren’t wrestling with your own overwhelming same-sex attractions, you would care less about what gay people do. You certainly wouldn’t get all giddy about the issue, the way you have here repeatedly.

    I am not kidding about this. It really is blatantly obvious that you are wrestling with your same-sex attractions and projecting them onto the rest of us. It wouldn’t be fair to your wife for you to act on your attraction to men, but accepting that about yourself may be a first step towards finding peace with it.

    Just sayin’.

  138. Piffy!

    entop-

    I am not kidding about this, either. It really is blatantly obvious that you are wrestling with your same-sex attractions and projecting them onto the rest of us. It wouldn’t be fair to your wife for you to act on your attraction to men, but accepting that about yourself may be a first step towards finding peace with it.

  139. Piffy!

    i didnt realize you liked to claim everyone you disagree with is gay.

  140. Piffy!

    its a known fact coffee makes you gay.

    by which i mean happy, of course.

  141. Chad Nesbitt

    It’s not the coffee. The fact is, it’s the ones that use Sweet n Low instead of sugar in their coffee. Read the warning label.

    It say’s –

    WARNING – The Food and Drug Administration has issued the following statement. This product causes gay tendencies, paranoia, and the urge to think that all straight people that disagree with you are gay. Other side effects that may occur are changing your voter registration to Democrat,helping illegal aliens cross the border,and herpes.

    MY GOD! Somebody call 911 for entopticon!
    He’s OD on Sweet n Low!

  142. John

    We have us a cage match! E against the world!

    I sense 1000’s of words coming.

  143. entopticon

    Actually The (C3PO) and the shad… I would be happy to have been gay or bi and I am not claiming that everyone has a choice, so I have nothing to wrestle with. It’s funny because you seem to think it is somehow offensive to call me gay, but I couldn’t possibly care less. Seems like the two of you might be projecting again.

    My point is inarguable. Chad thinks it is a choice because it is a choice for him. If it wasn’t a choice for him, he wouldn’t assume that it is a choice for everybody else. There is no way around that fact.

    So yes, I do think that anybody who claims that sexual preference is a choice is projecting. It would be absolutely ridiculous for someone to assume that it is a choice for others if it wasn’t a choice for them.

    And that ties this back to the original thread. McCarthyism wasn’t just about seeing communist propaganda in your alphabet soup. It was also about the persecution of homosexuals.

    It was no coincidence that McCarthy’s two main arms of oppression, J. Edgar Hoover and Roy Cohn, were wrestling with their own same sex attraction. Just like Chad and travelah, they were confused and angry about their same sex attraction, and lashing out at homosexuals because of their own self-hatred.

    The reason that Chad and travelah have issues with homosexuals and project their choice not to indulge their same sex attractions onto people who don’t have a choice is the very same reason that so many right-wingers like Larry Craig and Ted Haggard do as well. Again, take a look for the trailer for the documentary about it that I linked to above.

    By the way The (TCBY)…. the fact that you whine and whine about going off topic then flood the list with off topic posts just gets funnier and funnier. Thanks for the laugh.

  144. travelah

    Chad is a faux’gay? He must be since all the rhetoric has the choice being what one is born into. What an interesting gooberism. Relating to the thread, could Mumpower be viewed as a faux’gay? The whole notion strikes me as a faux’intelectualism but of course I might be wrong.

  145. Chad Nesbitt

    Beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep.

    I’m calling it. 2:02PM. Patient entopticon died of over dose of Sweet n Low.

    It’s a shame.
    He was rushed to the hospital but had to wait in line for 11 hours to be seen by a doctor.
    He could have been seen, but there were so many illegal aliens in line that their priorities came before his. The Obama government health care plan did not save him.

    Cause of death – Democrat registration.

    ——————
    I’m just mess’in with you entopticon.

    Seriously, lighten up! You sexual intellectuals
    need to have a drink and go fish’in or something.
    Get your mind away from that propaganda the liberals teach you. All your comments are is tactics you learn from the Democrat Party to shut people up. To scare conservatives into leaving certain topics alone. I know all about that.
    I used to be a Democrat in a very political household.

    But, you could be one of these cultist Democrats that actually believe what you are saying. If so
    you need to snap out of it. You have listened to the lies and teachings of the Democrat Party until
    you have lost touch with reality.

    I want to help you.
    But I need to know some things first.

    1. Are you married?

    2. Do you have children?

    3. Do you have a job?

    4. Were your parents Democrats?

    All I need is just yes or no answers.
    No details.

  146. shadmarsh

    1. Yes
    2. Yes
    3. Yes, two of them
    4. Not sure. Im not a Democrat.

    So, dear font of wisdom, what can you tell me about myself from those 12 words?

  147. entopticon

    Chad and travelah, if you can give me one rational reason why a person who has no choice in their sexual preference would say that it is a choice for other people I am listening…

    The problem is that that of course there is no rational case for that. If it is not a choice for you, you would have no rational reason for claiming that it is a choice for other people, and if it is a choice for you, that means you are attracted to men.

    My argument is air tight.

  148. Chad Nesbitt

    Shadmarsh,

    Dude, there’s just no hope for you.
    Ha, Ha. Just kid.

    Wait till entopticon answers then I will answer yours.

  149. entopticon

    travelah asked: “Chad is a faux’gay?”

    No travelah, Chad is not faux gay. Like you, and anyone else who believes that sexual preference is a choice, he is bisexual. Those of us who are straight or gay know perfectly well that sexual preference is not a choice for everybody.

  150. Chad Nesbitt

    entopticon,

    Oh I got to hear this. Explain how you are attracted to a man if it is your choice to be with a woman? Let’s hear this liberal teaching.

  151. entopticon

    Oh and as for your silly quiz Chad, yes I am married, no I don’t have kids, I am self employed, My dad votes Republican, my mother is an Independent.

    Did it ever cross your mind that those illegal aliens that you are always disparaging are direct blood relatives of the indigenous people of this land? Their people have migrated back and forth across this continent for tens, if not hundreds of thousands of years.

    Contrary to the people like you who are so convinced that this is entirely their country since their ancestors slaughtered off most of the native people and stole their land, the indigenous people you constantly disparage as aliens actually have an ancient ancestral claim to this land.

    The truth is, the postcolonial muck we find ourself in presents myriad complicated problems with no easy solutions. Your bigoted xenophobia and paranoid isolationism only makes things worse.

  152. Chad Nesbitt

    Yep, I knew it. Entopticon is a cultist Democrat.

    You have got to stay away from Gordon Smith and people like him. They will make you drink
    the Kool Aid.

    I’m tell’in you bro…..you’ve gone Emo.
    Stay away from the kitchen knife set.
    P l e a s e!

  153. shadmarsh

    Do you even know what Emo means? Or are you just assuming it is slang for “gay”

  154. entopticon

    What’s not to get Chad? You are attracted to both men and women, but you choose to be with a woman. No matter how you slice it, if you weren’t attracted to both sexes, you wouldn’t see it as a choice.

    Like many straight and gay people, I have no choice in which gender I am attracted to, and that is why unlike you, I know for a fact that it is not a choice for everyone.

    If you weren’t attracted to both sexes you would know that too. There would be absolutely no logical reason for you to contend that it is a choice if it wasn’t a choice for you.

    Because you are attracted to both sexes, but choose to be with a woman, you project that choice onto the rest of us, who know perfectly well that choice has nothing to do with it for us. And like so many of your fellow right-wing McCarthyite extremists, your confusion and guilt over your bisexuality makes you obsessively lash out against the gay community.

  155. Chad Nesbitt

    Entopticon

    OK.

    Your married – She must be real proud.

    You have no children – There lyes part of your problem.

    Your self employed – Let me guess.
    Child psychologist.

    Your Dad votes Republican and your Mom votes Independent – Great.

    Diagnosis –

    You have “preachers son syndrome”. Wanting to be completely different from your Dad, you joined the leftist liberals and began to believe in what they said.

    My prescription –

    Have children. You will want the very best for them and their future. They will make you more ambitious and turn your life around. You will realize that your Dad was right and be more like him.

    But I think your lying about your answers.

    Just sayin.

  156. travelah

    Help me understand this. (Mumpower, please pay attention.) If one is attracted solely to one gender, they were born that way but if they are attracted to both genders, they do so out of environmentally determined choice? Would it be too much to assume there is some kind of science behind this startling revelation?

  157. Chad Nesbitt

    Shadmarsh,

    Dude, you told me it was that guy
    from Sesame Street. You know Oscars cousin.

    I think the little red guy is EMOTIONALLY disturbed.

  158. Chad Nesbitt

    Travelah,

    Entopticon is to far gone.
    He has had to much Kool Aid sweetened
    with Sweet n Low.

    I’m going back to work. Catch you guy’s later.

  159. John

    Easly and a bunch of others are going down. Feds and the NC Board of Elections are after him and will soon be after many more. It is very disappointing that it took this long.

    The rats are leaving the sinking ship!

  160. entopticon

    Chad… Diagnosis: that may be the most hilarious case of projecting that I have ever seen. We all know about your stepdaddy issues Chad, they are a matter of public record.

    Why on Earth would I have lied about my answers? What a funny claim.

    Make me more ambitious and turn my life around?!? My life doesn’t need turning around. It’s not like I clean sewers for a living. Compared to many people I know I am certainly not the most ambitious or accomplished person, and I certainly have plenty of shortcomings, but among other things I did manage to get myself an ivy league graduate degree, and if you think that’s an easy accomplishment you have a lot to learn. How about you, Chad?

    While we’re at it, I have a pop psych quit for you too…

    1. Do you have an unexplained fondness for gladiator movies?
    2. Do you find that your cheeks get flushed when you stroll by a fireman’s calendar at the mall?
    3. Do you spank yourself and cry out things about your stepdaddy while you obsess over the gay activists that infuriate you so much?
    4. While watching the footage from gay rights marches that you are so fond of, do you tell yourself that you are a naughty, naughty boy?

    And don’t think that I didn’t notice that you had no rational explanation for why anybody besides a bisexual person would think that sexual preference is a choice, because there is no rational argument to be made.

    I didn’t just suggest that you are bisexual, I virtually proved it, because no matter how you cut it, there is absolutely no rational reason that a person would claim it was a choice unless it was a choice for them.

  161. Piffy!

    “”what about decafe? “”

    thats like kissing your sister.

    or hot chicks who claim to be bisexual.

  162. travelah

    ” I certainly have plenty of shortcomings, but among other things I did manage to get myself an ivy league graduate degree, and if you think that’s an easy accomplishment you have a lot to learn.”

    Hummm …. George W. Bush, Yale ’68 History; Harvard ’75 MBA

  163. entopticon

    Hmmmm travelah… If my father had been George H W Bush and I was a C student like George W who had strings pulled in both cases, than that might be a more apt comparison. There were no C students accepted when I was there because that would have been murder on my school’s ranking. In fact, many straight A students were rejected. As it was, not a single undergrad from my University (students who were almost always in the top 1% of their class in their high schools and the vast majority got at least 1300 on their SAT’s) got into my grad program both years that I was there. I have friends with far more academic accomplishments and like most people I wish I was more gifted in some areas, but I graduated from a 3 year program in two years and won a department award both years, so I must not have been a total failure.

  164. travelah

    just saying … GWB has two Ivy League degrees to your one and of course you realize thats no easy accomplishment unless you have a lot to learn. Have a happy nite! :)

  165. entopticon

    As I said travelah, it is a fact that George W was a C student who was pushed through the system based on nepotism rather than accomplishment, so your comparison doesn’t hold water. I was responding to Chad’s fallacious claim that I had never accomplished anything in life, and fairly so.

    I have to say that is really funny that you would want to make an issue of my degrees again. Last week you claimed that I was lying about my degrees, but I provided incontrovertible evidence proving that it was indeed you who had been lying to everyone all along.

    Most people wouldn’t want to draw attention to the fact that they were caught lying red-handed in a public forum, but you certainly have a lot more tenacity than integrity.

    You have a happy night too travelah. I hope there is a good gladiator movie on to keep you warm.

  166. bobaloo

    Out of curiosity, what Ivy league grad school did you graduate from?

  167. Chad Nesbitt

    What’s uuuuuuuup! I’m back!

    Yeah, been hanging out with my step-daddy all week end watching Gladiator movies.

    I have decided to become a Democrat again and support entopticon’s leftist movement.

    Is it April fools day again? Is this Twitter?

    By the way, I went to college.

    Just sayin!

  168. entopticon

    Chad said: “Yeah, been hanging out with my step-daddy all week end watching Gladiator movies.”

    I’m sure you had fun then. Now Chad, don’t think I didn’t notice that you never answered my question even though I took the time to answer yours. Of course, that’s because we both know the answer, so I will answer it for you…

    QUESTION: What rational reason would there be to claim that sexual preference is a choice unless it is a choice for the person making that claim?

    ANSWER: Of course there is absolutely no rational reason whatsoever to claim that sexual preference is a choice unless it is a choice for the person making the claim.

    “By the way, I went to college.”

    That must have been quite a challenge for you. If you managed to make it all the way through despite your problems with literacy, you will know that the logic of my above argument is airtight and absolutely incontrovertible.

    “I have decided to become a Democrat again and support entopticon’s leftist movement.”

    You go girl!

  169. entopticon

    “Republicans are happier than Democrats”

    Ignorance is bliss.

  170. Chad Nesbitt

    Let me try to get your liberal slant straight-

    Your saying that because I am married, attracted to a female and choose to be with a female, that somehow that makes me gay?

  171. entopticon

    No Chad, since you “choose” to be with a female, that makes you bisexual. If you were straight, your sexual preference wouldn’t be a choice.

  172. Chad Nesbitt

    Entoticon said – <>since you “choose” to be with a female, that makes you bisexual. If you were straight, your sexual preference wouldn’t be a choice.<>

    Ha, Ha, LOL!
    That’s the stupidest thing I have ever heard.

    Here you go “Ivy League” – The definition of bisexual -(a person who is sexually “attracted” to both sexes) http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=bisexual

    I’m “attracted” to the female gender. I found the hottest one on the planet. Being that I am
    “only attracted” to the female gender makes me straight. Since I am only “attracted” to the female gender, I choose to be with a female.

    There is no “gay gene”. We are all born straight. The APA just proved it.
    http://www.onenewsnow.com/Culture/Default.aspx?id=528376

    You can choose your natural sexual attraction of men to women and procreate or
    choose sexual deviancy.

    This is why the leftist liberal agenda gay / marraige thing will never win. It is not a civil right to be gay because you are not born gay.
    Being gay or bisexual is a choice.

  173. entopticon

    Seriously Chad, did you graduate from college? Your inability to understand basic logic is kind of bizarre, and a little sad. Try to pay attention a little more carefully, because my logic here really is airtight and irrefutable.

    No matter how you slice it, if you “choose” to be with a female that means you could have chosen to be with a male. If you weren’t attracted to both sexes it wouldn’t have been a choice for you.

    Like other straight people, I have absolutely no choice in which gender I am attracted to. Unlike you, I did not choose to be with a female as opposed to a male. Unlike you, I could not have chosen to be with a male, because I am not attracted to both sexes.

    Like me, and unlike you, gay people don’t get to choose which gender they are attracted to. The only people who get to choose are bisexual people like you, who are attracted to both genders, but choose to be with one or the other. The rest of us have no choice.

    Again, the only rational reason that you would claim that a gay person has a choice is that you are projecting that they could choose to be with either gender, like you do. If you were only attracted to women and had no choice in the matter, it would be completely insane and ludicrously hypocritical for you to claim that other people have a choice that you don’t have.

    Amazingly, you still don’t get it. I didn’t just suggest that you are attracted to both sexes, I incontrovertibly proved it. If you were only attracted to women you wouldn’t have a choice in the matter, and you wouldn’t project that choice onto other people.

    Larry Craig is married too Chad. The two of you actually have much in common. Like you, he won’t admit his bisexuality despite the fact that it is completely obvious to everyone around him. Like you, guilt over his same-sex attraction makes him obsess on and lash out against the homosexual community. And like you, he projects his choice onto everyone else because he doesn’t realize that unlike the both of you, many of us, straight and gay, have no choice in the matter.

  174. Chad Nesbitt

    Dude I just gave you the definition of bisexual.
    You can’t stand the fact that you lost your argument.

    I’m telling you. Stay away from Gordon Smith.
    Go get a restraining order if you have to. LOL.
    He is a bad influence on you.

    Since your the one that came up with the Washington monument and gladiators, they must be on your mind a whole lot. Get your mind out of deviancy. It might save your marriage.

    Get a life.
    Get your priorities straight.
    Go hang with your Mom and Dad.

    Your parents seem to have some sense.
    Follow in their footsteps.

  175. shadmarsh

    Anyone else get the feeling that Chad is actually a covert operative for the Democratic party, on deep cover assignment, doing his level best to destroy the local Republican party?

  176. shadmarsh

    Oh, and Chad, if Angela Landsbury shows up on your doorstep holding the Queen of Hearts, look away…or don’t really, what do I care?

  177. Chad Nesbitt

    Anyone else get the feeling that Entopticon is doing his level best to destroy the Democrat party?

    Anyone else get the feeling we have turned this comment section into Topix?
    Sorry Mnt X.

  178. shadmarsh

    I believe Entop is unaffiliated….Something the Republicans wish they could say about you.

  179. Chad Nesbitt

    We republicans like the unaffiliated. That means they don’t buy into the Democrat propaganda and don’t like being lied to by our RINO’s.

    Entopticon is probably not even registered to vote.

  180. shadmarsh

    So that you notice…but you still can’t figure out your/you’re.

  181. entopticon

    Yes Chad, you gave me a definition of bisexual, a person who is sexually attracted to both sexes, and I logically proved that since you “chose” to be with a woman instead of a man, that means your are bisexual.

    Not only did I win the argument, I actually mopped the floor with your demonstrably illogical claims because you have no real argument.

    Now follow carefully Chad… by definition, choice means that you can choose. If you chose to be with a woman instead of a man, that means that by definition, you were attracted to both. There is no way around that fact. When you say that you chose to be with a woman instead of a man, by definition you are saying that you are attracted to men as well. Otherwise, there would be no choice in the matter.

    By definition, a gay person can’t choose to be attracted to the opposite sex, and a straight person can’t choose to be attracted to the same sex. By definition, the only people who can choose to be with either a man or a woman are bisexuals, because they are attracted to both sexes. If a person is not attracted to both sexes, they have no choice in the matter. The fact that you chose to be with a woman, and you think all other people have a choice in the matter, incontrovertibly proves my case.

    Is it really that hard for you to follow, or are you that deep in denial? My argument is absolutely unassailable. You can’t even counter with a rational argument, because there isn’t one to be made.

  182. Chad Nesbitt

    After reading Ash’s article about Topix.
    I can’t bare to do it to the Mountain Xpress.

    I’m gone.
    See you guys on the other Mnt. X articles.
    And damn guy’s. Try to stay on topic next time.

    STOMPERS RULE!

  183. Chad Nesbitt

    And yes entopticon I won. I backed all of my information up with (linked) facts. Something you could not do. I even got down in the gutter on your level and rationalized.

    A win for the common sense
    average citizen and family.

    STOMPERS RULE….AGAIN!

    CHALK ONE UP FOR THE CONSERVATIVES!

    Sucks to be ya! Have a nice day:)

  184. entopticon

    Actually Chad, I was completely on topic. It was not just a wild coincidence that the two key figures in McCarthyism, J Edgar Hoover and Roy Cohn, were both people who wrestled with their own homosexuality and used McCarthy’s witch hunt to lash out at the homosexual community, just as it is not just a wild coincidence that people like you, Larry Craig, and Carl Mumpower do the exact same thing today.

    The truth is, you and Mumpower embrace McCarthy’s xenophobic, homophobic witch hunt for the exact same nefarious reasons that J Edgar Hoover and Roy Cohn did. Until you come to terms with your bisexuality and stop projecting it onto the rest of us, you will continue to be tortured by the same demons, and you will continue to embrace twisted, bigoted ideologies such as McCarthyism.

  185. entopticon

    Are you delusional Chad? You failed to show a person could make a choice if they didn’t have a choice in the matter because that argument is completely irrational.

    I incontrovertibly proved my case that it is logically impossible for you to to have chosen to be with a woman instead of a man, unless you could have chosen to be with a man instead. If you weren’t attracted to both sexes, choice would have had nothing to do with it.

    Only bisexuals such as you have that choice. When you claim that other people have a choice, you are projecting your bisexuality onto the rest of us. Unlike you, I have no choice in which gender I am attracted to, and gay people don’t either.

  186. travelah

    Someone could be unaffiliated because they choose not to ally with a particular party or they could simply be something that cannot be identified with words.

  187. shadmarsh

    I think your point Trav, is a little too nuanced for Chad’s thinking. In fact I think I can see it now, sailing about 50 feet over his head.

  188. Piffy!

    Chad-Since i see you label yourself a capital C Conservative, I was wondering what it is, specifically, you would like to Conserve?

  189. John

    “Missing Link Discovered!”

    Intelligent Design Proponents quoted, “Doh!!”

  190. John

    just because the republican party is loosing registrations, you can’t assume those that left will vote democratic. The last election proved that … it was just about half and half, just like almost all presidential elections.

  191. entopticon

    Their defectors could vote for martians for all I care. It’s just very entertaining to watch the implosion of the GOP.

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